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EMNE: tandrem

tandrem 15.03.2017 13:02 #25369

Vedr. Alfa Spider 916 2,0 TS 2001.
Bilen købt for 3 år siden og havde da netop fået skiftet tandrem, der jo anbefales skiftet for hver 60000km/3 år. Bilen bruges mest til sommerkørsel og har kun kørt 20000 på de 3 år, så på det punkt er der ikke meget valuta for pengene. Er det km eller tid der er mest kritisk og tør man køre videre.

Sv: tandrem 15.03.2017 18:30 #25374

Det er tiden der er hård ved dem, og når motoren står stille hele vinteren, er tandrem bøjet det samme sted i lang tid.
Prisen for en ny rem i forhold til en ny motor hvis den smutter.
Men du kan nok spare lidt penge på vandpumpen.
PT. Alfa Romeo 159 2,4 210hk (232hk/508Nm)

Før: Alfetta 2.0 Berlina / 33 1.7Ie / 145 1.6ts / 146 1.6ts / 156 2,5 V6 / 156 1,8ts RST Berlina.

Sv: tandrem 15.03.2017 19:28 #25375

Hej
Jeg fik skiftet vores tandrem og vandpumpe efter ca. 5 års ( sommerkørsel ) mener at tidsintervallet er ca. 4 år, min mekaniker fortalte mig at den slet ikke var slidt, men at tandremmen bliver hård og mørner
Min mekaniker sagde til mig at jeg også skulle ofre pengene på vandpumpen, da den nemt kunne blive utæt efter en tid og det ville jo være træls, så om vores mekaniker også vil tjene på en ny vandpumpen eller den virkelig kan blive utæt, skal jeg ikke sige da det hele bare køre i vores Spider 916 årgang 1996. 2,0 t. Spark
Med venlig alfa hilsen Søren
Thy

Sv: tandrem 15.03.2017 19:43 #25376

ER der et problem med holbarheden??? på vandpumpen Twin spark modellerne.
Jeg var kun vidende om at det var V6 der skulle have skiftet vandpumpe for hver ca 60K

Sv: tandrem 15.03.2017 22:15 #25377

Der er ingen problemer med vandpumpen på V6 eller TS motor.
På V6 har der været nogle pumper med plastrotor monteret fra fabrikken, hvor de kunne gå i stykker. De burde være væk for længe siden.

Problemet er bare hvis den står af skal tandrem skiften på begge typer motor.
Og det koster en del på V6, op til 8-10000kr og så vælge mange og skifte vandpumpen for en sikkerhedsskyld.
På TS bliver vandpumpen trukket af tandrem og står den af med et brag, smadre det motoren. En ny koster typisk 500kr + lidt kølervæske og det vælge de fleste at gøre.
PT. Alfa Romeo 159 2,4 210hk (232hk/508Nm)

Før: Alfetta 2.0 Berlina / 33 1.7Ie / 145 1.6ts / 146 1.6ts / 156 2,5 V6 / 156 1,8ts RST Berlina.

Sv: tandrem 16.03.2017 00:06 #25378

Blandt de links, jeg ”har liggende”, har et Alfa-værksted; Alfamen i Australien, efter min mening givet en ret fin forklaring på det meste af, hvad man behøver at vide om holdbarheden af tand- og balanceremmene på bla. TS og JTS – fx ved at sammenligne med alm. gummielastikker…

“Group 1 – 4 Cylinder Timing Belts (2.0 Twin Spark and 2.0 JTS engines)

In these engines, we must consider that the engine actually contains 2 belts, 1 timing belt and 1 balance shaft drive belt. The failure of either belt is critical as even if the balance shaft belt breaks, the broken belt usually gets caught in the timing belt and results in timing belt failure. These two belts run side by side within the timing cover and because of space constraints both belts are relatively narrow in width. I’ve underlined the previous comment because the width (or lack of it) is the number one reason why these belts fail.

The wider the belt is, the stronger it is and in the case of ‘4 Cylinder’ belts… the lack of width results in a belt that is only just strong enough to handle the tension that it’s placed under every day. These belts have a tendency to snap as the belt weakens with age…. not because they wear out.

But why would the belt ‘weaken’ you may ask? Well it’s a case of numerous influences deteriorating the rubber / materials of which the belts are made. Like a rubber band, the belt weakens with mainly age, chemical attack and heat. While timing belts are made of the best materials available (much better than a rubber band), the belt still loses a percentage of its strength each year.

To calculate the point in time that the belt is likely to snap, we must put some figures to this discussion; the timing belt when new can handle about 150% of the load they’re subjected to daily. Some things accelerate the ageing process like engine oils / coolant on the belt and high engine bay temperatures, which, is at its highest when a car spends time idling in hot city traffic. In average conditions however, most timing / balance shaft belts will lose around 10% strength per year due to mainly age (I’m being slightly simplistic here… the real figure is probably 6% in the first year, a further 8% in the second year, a further 10% in the third, 15% in the fourth… you get the idea).

Anyway, by the time the belt is about 4-5 years old, it’s likely to break because where the belt once had a strength 50% greater than the load it was subjected to, that margin is reduced over time, to the point where no margin exists and the belt snaps. The result… catastrophe.

Upon breaking a timing belt the ‘4 Cylinder’ engines almost always bend all the inlet and exhaust valves and always require a cylinder head replacement or recondition as part of the repair. The other main aspect of the repair process is that the load exerted on the pistons following timing belt failure (valves hitting pistons) usually causes damage to the conrod bearings and if these are not replaced as part of the repair, it’s common for the conrod bearings to fail only weeks after a replacement / reconditioned cylinder head has been fitted. For these reasons, the cost of a repairing an engine after timing belt failure often reaches the $3500 – $4000 mark.

To conclude, ‘4 Cylinder’ timing belts break mainly due to age. While some people justify putting off a timing belt change with the argument “Even though the belt is 3 years old, I’ve only done XXX km’s”, this is a huge mistake and the number one reason why owners of 4 Cylinder engines get caught out.

Alfa Men advises all owners to closely monitor the age of their timing belt and as per Alfa Romeo’s advice have it replaced at 3 years of age or 60,000 km’s – whichever comes first. If the car has only done 10,000 km’s and it has been 3 years since the last timing belt change, it’s due for replacement.

And as a side note to this discussion, if you have already had the timing belt replaced and there are small ‘white out’ marks on you timing belt cove, chances are your belt was not fitted correctly. Every time I see an engine with these marks, I’m willing to bet money on the fact that the timing is wrong and the timing belt replacement has been done incorrectly.

I say this because with the correct Alfa Romeo tools there is no reason to place ‘white out’ marks on the engine cover. These marks tell me that
a) the mechanic who did the job doesn’t have the right tools and
b) the mechanic probably doesn’t do very many Alfa Romeo timing belts and is probably inexperienced at this task.”

Kilde: www.alfamen.com.au/timing-belts-explained/
.. hvor man evt. selv kan læse videre om remmene på V6'erne
Sidste redigering: 16.03.2017 00:11 af Peter Engholm-Pedersen.
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